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Wednesday, October 08, 2008

I Don't Want to Vote


I know I am posting alot. It's a mood I am in.
 The Tuesday update is still on time so keep checking in weekly.

So, I don't want to vote. The thought of it is making me nauseated. Isaiah chapter three says that a sign of God's judgment is when the young and when women rule over us. On one hand we have a deeply unwise baby with substantial ties to terrorism. He has voted for all of the bills that have led us into this current financial crisis. He is the most liberal candidate ever to be on the ticket. 
He is barely old enough to run for President.   

On the other hand we have an overlooked older man who has made some excellent choices in his political years. He voted to control Freddie and Fannie long ago. His sidekick , a woman, is a model of the Christian moralist agenda. The problem is that biblically we see that she being placed in the position she is in is not a beacon of hope to the female driven side of emerging church. 
Her position is a sign of judgment.

Do we pray to see who will bring the least judgment on our country while we get down on our faces and cry out for God's mercy?
(Denbigh suggested I choose a write in candidate like Voddie Baucham.)

 Isaiah 3 (does verse 14 sound like the current financial crisis?)

 11 Woe to the wicked! Disaster is upon them.
 They will be paid back for what their hands have done.

12 Youths oppress my people, 
       women rule over them. 
       O my people, your guides lead you astray; 
       they turn you from the path.

 13 The LORD takes his place in court; 
       he rises to judge the people.

 14 The LORD enters into judgment 
       against the elders and leaders of his people: 
       "It is you who have ruined my vineyard; 
       the plunder from the poor is in your houses.

9 comments:

Kyna said...

I don't want to vote either!

It was such a pleasant surprise to see you today. I wish it could be every week.

Tiffany Atwood said...

We just got an email from one of Travis' mentors calling for a fast for wisdom. Fast and pray from October 29 through election day for wisdom in our nation. God is in control, and we can also be on our knees before His Throne, repenting of OUR sins (just like Daniel did when he included himself when repenting of the sins of his fathers) and interceding for our nation. God placed us in this country, at this time, in this age to do something! To move His plan forward on earth - not by our own will and volition, but by His. There is a danger in all of us Christians throwing our hands up and not participating in God-ordained and God-created world systems, like government. If all of us leave and don't participate, then what? The enemy has free reign.

Terribly Interesting said...

Nobody is throwing their hands in the air. Neither of these candidates in biblically qualified and I don't want to vote towards the wrath of God. Either of these candidates spells judgment. God is still sovereign. Our nation, I am afraid, is in a steady decline with leaders who spell out Isaiah 3. No one said they were not voting. I said I don't want to. Seriously, is there no mature, God fearing, politically savvy man left in the United States?

Pasta Curls for Him said...

I say we all write in Huckabee...
A significant part of his adult life was spent as a pastor and denominational leader. He became the youngest president ever of the Arkansas Baptist State Convention, the largest denomination in Arkansas. Huckabee led rapidly growing congregations in Pine Bluff and Texarkana. He said those experiences gave him a deep sense of the problems faced by individuals and families.
THIS IS THE MAN I VOTED FOR IN THE PRIMARIES!

Terribly Interesting said...

I like him too. I wanted him to be on the ticket.

Tiffany Atwood said...

I apologize - I didn't mean to imply that you weren't going to vote or that you were throwing your hands in the air. Please forgive me! :) Your question at the end is what I was speaking to. Why aren't mature, God-fearing, politically savvy men running for office? We have an attorney friend who is such a man. He feels called to get into politics. And when he approached the Republican party about running for a local election, they were so into him. Until he refused to support "gentlemen clubs" in the district he would be running in. (You know, free markets & such.) When he refused, they refused him.

Neither party is biblical and neither candidate is biblically sound - you're absolutely right. What do we do? I have no idea - the only answer I have is to pray.

Your post has spurred on a bible research frenzy, though! I was curious about what the bible has to say about "woman" and "women". I'm not finished yet, but I came across Deborah in Judges 4 & 5 and wanted to get your thoughts. She led Israel, held court and decided disputes. What do we do this? In one scripture, women ruling is seen as judgment and here Deborah was instrumental in Israel's deliverance from Sisera and clearly ruled over men. I promise, I'm not trying to be antagonistic - I'm just honestly and earnestly seeking from God's Word in this.

Most of all, I love you, Stephanie! And I really appreciate your views and insights. You always inspire me to pursue Christ and dig deeper in His Word.

I can't wait to see you next week!

P.S. I like Mike too! That's who I voted for as well...

Terribly Interesting said...

Voddie actually talked about people using Deborah a few weeks ago on CNN. He explained that she was a sign of judgment (as per Isaiah 3). Her role does not line up with the biblical design for women. You can watch his interview on his blog. He actually has a ton to say on the issue over several posts.

http://www.voddiebaucham.org/vbm/Blog/Entries/2008/9/25_Voddie_Baucham_on_CNN.html

I was just reading this. Very interesting.
http://pedersenwritings.blogspot.com/

I love you too.

Terribly Interesting said...

from feelinfeminine.com

What About Deborah?



Posted by: Miss_Jocelyn : Category: Through A Spiritual-Window, What About...?
grew up with a mother who was always seeking to find a better way to live more Biblically, which has also made me seek out the more Biblical lifestyle. Whenever I would bring up women staying at home as Titus 2 instructs either the Proverbs 31 Woman or Deborah was thrown at me in defense of women being out in the work place or over the authority of men. I am really going to get into the Proverbs 31 Woman more as I’m writing some articles on her, but for now I want to share this excerpt from **So Much More by Anna Sofia and Elizabeth Botkin

Women Rulers as a sign of Judgment

“A Virtuous woman does not take a visible role in this sphere (in a work place or government building)”

When the nation Israel was being judge for her unfaithfulness to God’s laws and designs, the prophet Isaiah lamented her condition, “As for my people, children are their oppressors, and women rule over them…” (Isaiah 3: 12)

Rather then a sign of “progress” for a nation to have women rulers, it is a sign of God’s judgment and displeasure with that nation! Women holding seats of authority, whether it be business, church, family, law or politics, is one of the distinguishing marks of a society under God’s curse.

Rev. Einwechter said: “It is weakness and sin (on the part of the men who allowed it) because it is an abdication of their responsibility to be leaders God has called them to be… It is a sign of confusion and judgment. It is a sign that men have utterly failed to exercise the leadership required of them.”

But since our society is under God’s curse, aren’t there things that a godly woman magistrate could do to make things better? If a woman wants to do her society a favour, the last thing she should do is to extend God’s curse even further by perpetuating the feminist tactics that helped invoke His curse on our society in the first place. However good a woman’s intentions may be, the ends never justify the means. As William H. Felix put it: “Give woman a ballot, put her upon a platform, make her equal of man in every respect, and let her enter the arena of politics strife and religious reformation under the idea that her power must be utilized, and you thwart the end by the wrong use of the means”

A godly woman might seem more qualified to serve the office of civil magistrate then any man around, and, in fact, she might be more qualified. She might be able to do more immediate outward good, but in the end it will ultimate detriment of her society. It has been God’s practice to bless entire nations because of an individual’s godliness and obedience. (Example is Joseph in Egypt.) The best thing a woman can do for her country, regardless of it’s situation, is to pursue God’s perfect design for her life and her role as a woman, so that her righteousness will entreat God to revoke his judgment on her country and instead shower blessings on it.

What about Deborah? Wasn’t she a judge? People who want to make a biblical case for women taking leadership in the civil realm point to Deborah in the book of Judges. “We should be judges, like Deborah!” is a rallying point. Before jumping to any conclusions, we should first seek to understand what exactly Deborah was doing.

The scene is Israel, at a time when the “children of Israel again did evil in the sight of the Lord” (Judges 4: 1). Deborah describes the scenes in chapter 5vv. 6 and 7 “The highways were deserted, and the travelers walked along the byways. Village life ceased, it ceased in Israel…” Commentators note that, “Israel’s failed leadership had resulted in chaos and foreign domination. It was not like the days in which God had been the warrior at the front of Israel. The roads were abandoned because they were not safe for travel on account of foreigner oppressors and robbers. Israel was under severe judgment from God, and the context of Judges 5:2 suggests that the reason was that the leaders were not leading.

Verse 7 continues: “… Until I, Deborah, arose, arose a mother in Israel.” Chapter 4-5 tells us, “Now Deborah, a prophetess, the wife of Lipidoth, as judging Israel at that time. And she would sit under the palm tree of Deborah between Ramah and Bethel in the mountains of Ephraim. And the children of Israel came to her for her judgment.”

Deborah’s role in Israel was that of a “prophetess”, but not that of civil ruler or military leader. The text does not support the idea that she was a civil magistrate. She “judged” Israel (Judges 4:4) only in the sense that she was sought out by people for advice and judgment in the settlement of disputes because of her wisdom from God. Apparently the priests and the Levites were so corrupt that the people had to seek wisdom and judgment for this godly woman…the judges during this period were more military or “avenging delivers” then they were civil magistrates. Because of this fact, we must ask ourselves if we can even consider Deborah to be a judge in the same sense as the other judges in the book. The account of Deborah is unique in that she did not lead Israel into battle herself (as did the other judges in the book), but, rather, the Lord choose Barak to be the military commander.

Vs. 6-8: “then she sent and called Barak… and said to him, ‘has not the Lord God of Israel commanded, “Go and deploy troops at Mount Tabor; take with you 10,000 men… and against you I will deploy Sisera… and I will deliver him into your hands”?’ And Barak said to her, “if you will go with me, then I will go; but if you will not go with me, I will no go!”

As a result of Barak’s cowardice in effectively hiding behind Deborah and asking her to do what he had been assigned to do, Deborah announced, “ I will surely go with you; nevertheless, there will be no glory for you in your journey you are taking, for the Lord will sell Sisera into the hand of a woman.’ (Judges 4:9)

Deborah’s society was being Judged in much the same way as ours, but the level of judgment seems to have been more severe. In this very unfortunate time, when it appears that there was not even one man who would take the responsibility of leadership, God dud raise up a woman to encourage and support the men, and also to sham them for their cowardice. It’s important to note that not all the women in Israel were called to lead the way Deborah was, and even she tired to pass leadership to Barak when god so instructed. The role of a “Deborah” is not one we should be hoping to for, but one we should be trying to at all cost to prevent.

If our society even sinks to the level where one Deborah is necessary, it will be a sign that God is phenomenally displeased with our culture and is inflicting a colossal curse on it. Deborah was glorified and blessed by God as a “deliver” of Israel, and, in essence, what she did was to bring men back to leadership”

- The Botkin Sisters

If you are for “modern day Deborah”, please realize the danger of it and displeasure it is to God. Instead of getting all rallied up for women in authority and the feminist view, start praying for the men in your family, your church, your area to become Biblical leaders so we have no need for Deborah’s. It has nothing to do with being weak - women are capable of just about anything. It has to do with the God ordain-roles for the family, men and women.

Again more coming on the Proverbs 31 Woman. I have been finding one thing in particular that many don’t understand about her. More later.



**Please note I don’t believe or endorse all the Botkin’s theology.

Tiffany Atwood said...

Thanks for this on Deborah - and the Pedersen blog was helpful as well. :) I think I'll be getting on my knees as soon as I sign off here. This was quite fun tonight. My brain has enjoyed the workout.

Love you & good night!
Tiff